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<div class="moz-cite-prefix">Ken, you are very close to the actual
numbers. <br>
<br>
A few comments:<br>
* The iCE40 series is not an option - too small both in cell count
and pin count. Even the Xilinx Spartan6 in 144 QFP package wont
have enough pins so you have to go BGA which will increase the
assembly cost.<br>
* You have to build at least 100 boards to get a reasonable
assembly cost, which will tie up something like $10000 in
capital. If you are lucky you will sell all of the boards or you
will get stuck with unsold inventory.<br>
* The assembly house typically have a one-time setup cost
(stencils, p&p programming etc.) at typically around $300 (or
$3 per board if you build 100).<br>
* PayPal or the credit card processor will take about 3% cut or
about $3 for a $100 board<br>
* Don't forget packaging materials like shipping box, padded bags
etc.<br>
* There will be some non-functional boards. What if a board gets
lost or damaged in shipping, who will pay for that?<br>
* You need to build prototypes to make sure the design is good
before starting production. Components and PCBs for the
prototypes will cost you $500 - $1000 and those boards really
can't be sold.<br>
* You need to put in several man-weeks of design time to make it
happen.<br>
<br>
So hopefully it's quite clear that selling a board like Pepino
LX9/1MB that will run Oberon RISC5 right out of the box for $99.95
is not driven by a desire to make money but rather an effort to
make such a board available at a reasonable cost so that others
have the opportunity to venture into the world of Oberon RISC5 and
FPGAs in general.<br>
<br>
For more info about Pepino LX9/1MB see
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://saanlima.com/store/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=64">http://saanlima.com/store/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=64</a><br>
<br>
Magnus<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
On 2/8/2016 11:18 AM, Ken Boak wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote
cite="mid:CAOqQ0iYsEfAhsV30TCziW-umMKTfDJ1AbC=x0ff-ysvJgLJMpA@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">Lars,
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Perhaps you could choose a cheaper FPGA - such as the
Altera iCE40 series ($7) and a couple of 512K x 16 SRAMs at
$13.35.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Then there's the FT2232 at $6.69, and then something like a
FTDI Vinculum to act as USB host at $3.99.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>A 2.25" x 4" 4 layer board will be about $10 from
China - but MOQ is 5off. Then there's about $5 to $10 of
assorted other components like the connectors, voltage
regulator, LEDS, microSD card.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>So we are up to almost $65 and you haven't even placed a
single component. Add another 25% for assembly. What about
programming and testing?</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Right, board built, untested for $81.25. Do you need to
make a profit on this?</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Now you just have to port the risc 5 across to the Altera
iCE 40 - which should take a good FPGA engineer about a
week.....</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Alternatively you could run Oberon under Linux on a Pi or a
chip, or perhaps just order a $3 PS/2 mouse online.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Enjoy........</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
</div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On 8 February 2016 at 18:12, <span
dir="ltr"><<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:skulski@pas.rochester.edu" target="_blank">skulski@pas.rochester.edu</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">Lars:<br>
<br>
It is sort of funny that one can use the low price as an
argument. How<br>
much do you value your time? Let's say it is $5 per hour,
way below<br>
minimum wage. How much time will you spend on getting
anything done with<br>
any piece of hardware, be it Arduino, RPi, Beagle Bone, or
Oberon Station?<br>
Are you going to achieve anything meaningful in less than 10
hours? If so<br>
then I will consider hiring you for $50 per hour.<br>
<br>
The low price does indeed matter if you will use the
hardware in a<br>
finished product. They are talking of a disposable computer.
If you are<br>
going to basically throw it away after a single use
(provided that you<br>
environmental soul lets you do it), then indeed $9 matters.
But if you are<br>
going to do any development or experimentation with the HW,
then you will<br>
likely spend hundreds of hours doing so. Then it does not
matter if you<br>
invest $9, $90, or even $900 into your hardware. Almost any
such amount is<br>
dwarfed by the cost of your time.<br>
<br>
Oberon Station is a development platform. The valid question
is<br>
"development of what?". The initial dollar investment in the
development<br>
hardware is not that important in this case.<br>
<br>
W.<br>
<br>
<br>
> The oberon station is tempting, but with Raspberry Pi
at $35<br>
> or the C.H.I.P computer for $9.00... that has USB,<br>
> and WIFI that works like any wifi, the oberon station<br>
> is really priced way out of the market. If the<br>
> oberonstation was around $50 more people would buy.<br>
> How can you possibly compete with the C.H.I.P.<br>
> for $9.00.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
--<br>
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href="mailto:Oberon@lists.inf.ethz.ch">Oberon@lists.inf.ethz.ch</a>
mailing list for ETH Oberon and related systems<br>
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</blockquote>
</div>
<br>
</div>
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