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    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">Hi Sören,<br>
      <br>
      could you be a bit more specific about this graphics genius and
      his achievements?<br>
      <br>
      Regards<br>
      Dieter<br>
      <br>
      Am 20.11.2017 um 18:48 schrieb Søren Renner:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CAJuGca8BXw4waehKruVUODownGi6areBYKY3hN1z00q0KTAwmA@mail.gmail.com">
      <div dir="ltr"><span style="font-size:12.8px">That?s another way
          of saying that Oberon isn?t exactly a growth</span><br
          style="font-size:12.8px">
        <span style="font-size:12.8px">story. There were more Oberon
          developers in the 90s..</span><br>
        <div><span style="font-size:12.8px"><br>
          </span></div>
        <div><span style="font-size:12.8px">Well, but at least one of
            the current coders working in Oberon has created something
            that will shake the foundations of realtime graphics. So
            Oberon might become less obscure again.</span></div>
      </div>
      <div class="gmail_extra"><br>
        <div class="gmail_quote">On Mon, Nov 20, 2017 at 6:00 AM, <span
            dir="ltr"><<a
              href="mailto:oberon-request@lists.inf.ethz.ch"
              target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">oberon-request@lists.inf.ethz.ch</a>></span>
          wrote:<br>
          <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
            .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">Send
            Oberon mailing list submissions to<br>
                    <a href="mailto:oberon@lists.inf.ethz.ch"
              moz-do-not-send="true">oberon@lists.inf.ethz.ch</a><br>
            <br>
            To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit<br>
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            or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to<br>
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              moz-do-not-send="true">oberon-request@lists.inf.ethz.<wbr>ch</a><br>
            <br>
            You can reach the person managing the list at<br>
                    <a href="mailto:oberon-owner@lists.inf.ethz.ch"
              moz-do-not-send="true">oberon-owner@lists.inf.ethz.ch</a><br>
            <br>
            When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more
            specific<br>
            than "Re: Contents of Oberon digest..."<br>
            <br>
            <br>
            Today's Topics:<br>
            <br>
               1. Re: V4 versus S3 survey (eas lab)<br>
               2. Re: Translating ETHOberon 2.5 to C (eas lab)<br>
               3. Re: V4 versus S3 survey (Skulski, Wojciech)<br>
               4. Re: V4 versus S3 survey (Douglas G Danforth)<br>
               5.  V4 versus S3 survey (Andreas Pirklbauer)<br>
            <br>
            <br>
            ------------------------------<wbr>------------------------------<wbr>----------<br>
            <br>
            Message: 1<br>
            Date: Sun, 19 Nov 2017 13:16:43 +0000<br>
            From: eas lab <<a href="mailto:lab.eas@gmail.com"
              moz-do-not-send="true">lab.eas@gmail.com</a>><br>
            To: ETH Oberon and related systems <<a
              href="mailto:oberon@lists.inf.ethz.ch"
              moz-do-not-send="true">oberon@lists.inf.ethz.ch</a>><br>
            Subject: Re: [Oberon] V4 versus S3 survey<br>
            Message-ID:<br>
                    <<a
href="mailto:CAN3-DLHp95wV%2BN0-Hc9niQ8GJjc083HFq2nKjs5KXkMV2khVXQ@mail.gmail.com"
              moz-do-not-send="true">CAN3-DLHp95wV+N0-<wbr>Hc9niQ8GJjc083HFq2nKjs5KXkMV2k<wbr>hVXQ@mail.gmail.com</a>><br>
            Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"<br>
            <br>
            It's important to realise why-would-you-want-to-use Oberon ?<br>
            When you have a complex problem, that needs simultaneous
            inspection of<br>
            many files,<br>
            and intermediate reluslts, and especially where coloring
            parts of the<br>
            textFrames shows<br>
            the otherwise difficult to appreciate relationship between
            various<br>
            sections of the text in<br>
            the various TextFrames.<br>
              In the 90s Oberon gave these advantages [still
            unsurpassed], but the<br>
            introduction<br>
            of new technology, eg, the monsterously complex USB, could
            have made ETHO<br>
            redundant, had ETHO not been portable enough to be allowed
            to ride-on-top-of<br>
            *nix.<br>
            <br>
            For me: V4 was the only version I could find, while I was
            forced to use M$pook;<br>
            and like the *nix version was some relief from the
            restrictions of M$, but like<br>
            the *nix version lacked the ease of directly being able to
            read/write anywhere<br>
            in the file tree -- which AFAIK only Linux Eth Oberon can
            do.<br>
            LEO also has the massively powerful ability to directly
            execute *nix commands<br>
            and scripts [and show the results]. So eg. the [absurd IMO]
            inability<br>
            to <List the<br>
            N most recently-ordered files>, needs only LEO's
            System.Execute to call:<br>
              Lz /mnt/USBstik/Med/Cases/F*g/  22<br>
            to show the name and size of the ordered-by-recentcy 22
            files, in directory<br>
            [don't use M$pook baby-talk and call it a folder]
            /mnt/USBstik/Med/Cases/F*g/<br>
            .....<br>
            <br>
            <br>
            ------------------------------<br>
            <br>
            Message: 2<br>
            Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2017 01:39:25 +0000<br>
            From: eas lab <<a href="mailto:lab.eas@gmail.com"
              moz-do-not-send="true">lab.eas@gmail.com</a>><br>
            To: ETH Oberon and related systems <<a
              href="mailto:oberon@lists.inf.ethz.ch"
              moz-do-not-send="true">oberon@lists.inf.ethz.ch</a>><br>
            Subject: Re: [Oberon] Translating ETHOberon 2.5 to C<br>
            Message-ID:<br>
                    <<a
href="mailto:CAN3-DLEeRxZt-LiRYrJDUWmwuTpeijfxwJFRb6og%2BR3YP3KR0Q@mail.gmail.com"
              moz-do-not-send="true">CAN3-DLEeRxZt-<wbr>LiRYrJDUWmwuTpeijfxwJFRb6og+<wbr>R3YP3KR0Q@mail.gmail.com</a>><br>
            Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"<br>
            <br>
            <Note sheet> format must be very <graphic>,<br>
            getting close to hardware ?<br>
            Needing access to ETHO's functions which don't exist in C.<br>
            C is just a language, not an OS.<br>
            <br>
            ETHOberon is a language and an OS [driving hardware].<br>
            These O to C translators wont handle the <Note sheet
            rendering>.<br>
            <br>
            PublicDomain wily [my most used linux utility] is based on
            ETHO:<br>
            mouse-chording & multiple TextFrames in multiple Tracks
            accessible<br>
            on the single screen. But they've just copied the CONCEPTS
            and not<br>
            tried to translate-Oberon-to-C<br>
            <br>
            Unless your app just generates the <data> which is
            finally fed to some<br>
            <standard renderer>. Eg. we can use any
            language/system to translate<br>
            a text file to a corresponding pdf rendering of it.<br>
            But the final <note sheet> is created by the pdf
            renderer.<br>
            <br>
            <br>
            ------------------------------<br>
            <br>
            Message: 3<br>
            Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2017 06:41:45 +0000<br>
            From: "Skulski, Wojciech" <<a
              href="mailto:skulski@pas.rochester.edu"
              moz-do-not-send="true">skulski@pas.rochester.edu</a>><br>
            To: ETH Oberon and related systems <<a
              href="mailto:oberon@lists.inf.ethz.ch"
              moz-do-not-send="true">oberon@lists.inf.ethz.ch</a>><br>
            Subject: Re: [Oberon] V4 versus S3 survey<br>
            Message-ID:<br>
                    <<a
href="mailto:DM5PR0701MB3672C5244CE2BAFE92502858FF220@DM5PR0701MB3672.namprd07.prod.outlook.com"
              moz-do-not-send="true">DM5PR0701MB3672C5244CE2BAFE92<wbr>502858FF220@DM5PR0701MB3672.<wbr>namprd07.prod.outlook.com</a>><br>
            <br>
            Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"<br>
            <br>
            Hello:<br>
            <br>
              I want to thank everybody who responded. Those who did
            not, please do!<br>
            <br>
            The results thus far are available through this link. I hope
            it works for everybody.<br>
            <br>
            <a href="https://www.surveymonkey.com/results/SM-YSV9HDQJ8/"
              rel="noreferrer" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">https://www.surveymonkey.com/<wbr>results/SM-YSV9HDQJ8/</a><br>
            <br>
            My impression looking at the results is the following:<br>
            <br>
            1. The community is small. Assuming that 29 persons who
            responded (thank you!) represent 1/2 of the community, there
            are under 100 Oberon users worldwide.<br>
            <br>
            2. I was surprised that many of you prefer the original TUI
            Oberon over V4 or S3.<br>
            <br>
            3. I was even more surprised to see six FPGA developers,
            plus seven potential developers. It is more than I know in
            the entire nuclear physics community, where FPGAs are
            critically important. Our community could serve the entire
            country!<br>
            <br>
            4. There are three potential board developers, including
            myself.<br>
            <br>
            5. The market for a new more powerful board is six
            customers.<br>
            <br>
            So this is quite interesting. Good to know!<br>
            <br>
            Thank you again!<br>
            <br>
            Wojtek<br>
            <br>
            ------------------------------<br>
            <br>
            Message: 4<br>
            Date: Sun, 19 Nov 2017 23:43:48 -0800<br>
            From: Douglas G Danforth <<a
              href="mailto:danforth@greenwoodfarm.com"
              moz-do-not-send="true">danforth@greenwoodfarm.com</a>><br>
            To: <a href="mailto:oberon@lists.inf.ethz.ch"
              moz-do-not-send="true">oberon@lists.inf.ethz.ch</a><br>
            Subject: Re: [Oberon] V4 versus S3 survey<br>
            Message-ID: <<a
              href="mailto:8caf39c6-a812-6ee6-80cc-ccd42a3de664@greenwoodfarm.com"
              moz-do-not-send="true">8caf39c6-a812-6ee6-80cc-<wbr>ccd42a3de664@greenwoodfarm.com</a><wbr>><br>
            Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"; Format="flowed"<br>
            <br>
            Don't forget the Russian contingent who are developing in<br>
            BlackBox/Component Pascal.<br>
            <br>
            On 11/19/2017 10:41 PM, Skulski, Wojciech wrote:<br>
            > 1. The community is small. Assuming that 29 persons who
            responded (thank you!) represent 1/2 of the community, there
            are under 100 Oberon users worldwide.<br>
            <br>
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            <br>
            ------------------------------<br>
            <br>
            Message: 5<br>
            Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2017 09:49:46 +0100<br>
            From: Andreas Pirklbauer <<a
              href="mailto:andreas_pirklbauer@yahoo.com"
              moz-do-not-send="true">andreas_pirklbauer@yahoo.com</a>><br>
            To: ETH Oberon and related systems <<a
              href="mailto:oberon@lists.inf.ethz.ch"
              moz-do-not-send="true">oberon@lists.inf.ethz.ch</a>><br>
            Subject: [Oberon]  V4 versus S3 survey<br>
            Message-ID: <<a
              href="mailto:B081E179-7C39-474E-99E2-D760675B731F@yahoo.com"
              moz-do-not-send="true">B081E179-7C39-474E-99E2-<wbr>D760675B731F@yahoo.com</a>><br>
            Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"<br>
            <br>
            > 1. The community is small. Assuming that 29 persons who<br>
            > responded (thank you!) represent 1/2 of the community,<br>
            > there are under 100 Oberon users worldwide.<br>
            <br>
            That?s another way of saying that Oberon isn?t exactly a
            growth<br>
            story. There were more Oberon developers in the 90s..<br>
            <br>
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            <br>
            ------------------------------<br>
            <br>
            Subject: Digest Footer<br>
            <br>
            --<br>
            <a href="mailto:Oberon@lists.inf.ethz.ch"
              moz-do-not-send="true">Oberon@lists.inf.ethz.ch</a>
            mailing list for ETH Oberon and related systems<br>
            <a href="https://lists.inf.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/oberon"
              rel="noreferrer" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">https://lists.inf.ethz.ch/<wbr>mailman/listinfo/oberon</a><br>
            <br>
            <br>
            ------------------------------<br>
            <br>
            End of Oberon Digest, Vol 162, Issue 8<br>
            ******************************<wbr>********<br>
          </blockquote>
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      <pre wrap="">--
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:Oberon@lists.inf.ethz.ch">Oberon@lists.inf.ethz.ch</a> mailing list for ETH Oberon and related systems
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://lists.inf.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/oberon">https://lists.inf.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/oberon</a>
</pre>
    </blockquote>
    <p><br>
    </p>
    <pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">-- 
____________________________________
Dr. Dieter Glötzel
Im Rosengarten 27
64367 Mühltal
Tel.: 06151 / 360 82 72</pre>
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