[Oberon] Re: Oberon digest, Vol 1 #20 - 8 msgs

[muller at inf.ethz.ch]

"Ghost in the Machine" <cangelich at famvid.com> wrote:
> There might also be problems because the source is in a ZIP'd file
> and early versions of Oberon had ARC files?

The zip program for older releases is at:
ftp://ftp.inf.ethz.ch/pub/ETHOberon/Native/Update/ZipTool.Arc

> I was referring to execute from the CD, not install from the CD.

Bluebottle and Native can execute from CD.  You get a full 
Oberon system from where you can use the Partitions.Tool to 
format a partition and install the system.  Or you could just
use it directly from the CD and ram disk.

In fact, the Oberon install floppy also boots a stripped-down,
but otherwise normal Oberon system.

> I never specified that the CWD would be global.  You've replied to a
> statement I never made.

Sorry if this was unclear, but I wasn't replying to a statement.
I was commenting in general on the issue of a current working 
directory in Oberon.  IMHO the way it has been added in some 
versions of Oberon with a global current directory is not ideal.

> Maybe not but right now I don't think globbing all files into one huge
> directory is going to fit in well with real world use of Oberon.

It's all a question of organization.  I use three Oberon systems 
~95% of the time: Native (on Aos), Windows Oberon and Linux 
Oberon.  The latter two have directories (and a global current 
directory concept), the former has it only for FAT filesystems, 
which I don't really use day-to-day.

I organize my files using .Tool texts (as described in Project 
Oberon).  When I create "throw-away" files I always name them 
Temp* so I can easily delete them.  When I need to search for 
some file by content I use the Find.Panel, as I would use 
find/grep on Unix or the Search Files menu on Windows.

When I'm working on some project I add Desktops.OpenDoc commands
to the System.InitCommands section of Oberon.Text so that these
files are automatically opened when I start Oberon.  The rest
of my project files are all named in Projects.Tool.

BTW I don't use the full-screen Gadgets desktop, but the 
original tiling system, with Gadgets documents.

On Windows Oberon and Linux Oberon I never change the current 
directory, because I invariable forget where I am and make a mess.
It is possible to display the current directory in a TextField
Gadget using the CurrentDirectory model, but I live without it.

> Anyone counting the incompatibilities between the different versions
> at the ETH server?  Seems only portions of the user-interface are
> similar but under that there are some significant differences.

This should be improved in new releases towards the end of the year.

> Even when an OS is undergoing independent development they usually
> at least share identical file system structures.  There are some irreconcileable
> differences between versions.

Linux is a counterexample, unless I'm misunderstanding what you're 
saying.  There are at least three mainstream file systems: ext2, 
ext3 and ReiserFS.

> Are you anticipating losing access to the ETH servers or do you mean
> something entirely different?

No.  I just meant that the research in Prof. Gutknecht's group
will be moving on to other topics (as has been happening the
last few years) and maintenance of the Oberon system will be 
done from outside the ETH, but still with their support.
That is the main reason why the license has been changed to
an open-source BSD-style license.  I suspect the same people 
will continue doing the maintenance, at least for the forseeable 
future.

> FTP uses 4096 blocks when transferring files.  I doubt file
> size would have a significant affect on efficiency.

I'm not sure which blocks you are talking about here.
FTP opens a new TCP connection for every file transferred.
If you've studied the protocol you'll know the overhead 
involved.  BTW I highly recommend TCP/IP Illustrated Vol 1/2 
by Stevens.

-- Pieter

P.S. Due to a networking problem on the server hosting the mailing
list processor, oberon at inf was not accepting mail during the last
half day.  The problem is resolved now.

--
Pieter Muller, Computer Systems Institute, ETH Zurich / MCT Lab, Zurich
Native Oberon OS: http://www.oberon.ethz.ch/native/