[Oberon] PPP

[Charles Angelich]

>Message: 10
>Date: Wed, 07 Aug 2002 00:03:32 +0200
>From: Edgar Schwarz <edgar at edgarschwarz.de>
>To: oberon at inf.ethz.ch
>CC: edgar at edgarschwarz.de
>Subject: [Oberon] Re: PPP Native/Oberon/Beta 08.12.00
>Reply-To: oberon at inf.ethz.ch
>
>From: 
>Charles Angelich <cangelich at famvid.com>
>> Not so very good. I decided getting Oberon emailing was going to take
>> too long.  I'm using Eudora Lite.  Seems to work?

>Fine for you.

Reading these suggestions from within Oberon would save me the time required
to reboot back into Oberon to try what was suggested. :-\

>> > > OK.  It would be a good idea for me to delete the wrong instructions,
>> > > correct?
>> > This meaning no PAPName and PAPPassword in Oberon.Text.
>> I should delete those parts of Oberon.Text and any references to them?

>Yes. They probobly don't hurt but also don't help.

It's the "probably" in that statement that worries me.

>> > Remember middle mouse in the scrollbar ?
>> You don't understand. At 800x600 display Chapter2.Text will NOT scroll
>> down once you reach the chart of compiler switches.  It will not scroll
>> down if you use the scrollbar, if you hit it with a hammer, nor if you
>> curse it.  IT WILL NOT ALLOW ME TO READ THE ENTIRE PAGE.
>Especially for you today I fired up my old 486 with 640x480 and NO 
>11.10.2001. Desktops.OpenDoc Chapter2.Text , scroll to the chart,
>skip it by absolute positioning with middle mouseclick in the scrollbar
>and voila, it worked.

Voila, I'm using 08.02.00 Native/Oberon/Update/Beta.

I've explained several times that I need to keep Oberon within a single
loopback FAT file host right now and that the Alpha version of Native
is unfinished and cannot install into the FAT loopback file system.

What works in an install I cannot do is not helpful right now.

>> Can I increase the font size to something less that sub-micro?

>Select text and change font e.g. by using TextDocs.Panel.

This affects ALL onscreen text sizes?  I can't see the "Store" button
now.  If the text in the tool bar at the time of the viewer increases
I will lose other buttons that I can see now.

>> If I get my version online again I will get the URL to you.  My
>> version looks much nicer. :-)

>I'm sure of that. If it had in addition a means  to send me mail when
>something was posted this would be great :-)

My daughter does webdesign for a living and suggested that function.  I
will try to remember to ask her if it can be added.  I'm reasonably
certain that it is a trivial additon.

>BTW, concerning  mailing list and newsgroup they fundamentally have the 
>same functionality. The main difference ist that the mailing list pushes 
>information and from the newsgroup you have to pull it.
>So I guess if I had access to the server running the mailinglist and
>the mailinglist could be accessed e.g. by Python I would sync them.
>This could be done by a cron job for checking the newsgroup for new
>posts and forward them to the mailing list. And and extension to the
>mailing list to post every mail also to c.l.o.
>Shouldn't take that long but would help the world showing that Oberon
>isn't that dead and OTOH help people who don't have access to newsgroups.

I would like that if it was working properly. :-)

>> >http://www.edgar-schwarz.de/wwwboard/ as a means to leave me notes.
>> > > Won't be much help to me though.  I don't speak German (but am
>> > > one half German).

>> > The forum itself is in English and doesn't forbid postings in English.
>> > So what's your problem ?

>> I can't get much useful information from text in German
>You don't need that for posting. Also my idea was mainly for collecting
>contributions. From you conveniently in English naturally.
>> and if the replies were in German

>O dear, what do you think of Germans ? Do you think we are all idiots to
>answer an English post in German ?

No, I think any other useful information there would not be available to
me.  I would be contributing but not getting a great deal in return.  My
time to read every website forum is limited.

> > I would need to ask someone to translate the text for me.
>N/A
>> Sound like a problem to you ?
>Think again please.
>
>BTW, some of your critisisms concerning Oberon are at the point but
>nevertheless a lot of work was done the last ten years.

It is not my intent nor my inclination to denegrate what has been
accomplished.  My perception of the time that has passed and what
I would expect to have accomplished given that time frame is almost
irrelevant.  Each of us can only do as much as we are able to do.

>Speaking for myself I can only register your points concerning PPP
>and try to improve the documentation.

Re: improve the documentation.

I did read PPP.Tool and take notes as I read.  The alternate methods
for SLIP and PAP should not be combined within paragraphs (my opinion).
It is a bit confusing requiring that I re-read to be certain I am not
mistaking SLIP alternatives with PAP.  I also added the missing Network
commands to the system track, in particular those that were not
documented elsewhere.  I added these in the order required to get Oberon
online and then offline (hangup etc.) plus the optional logging/debugging
commands.

Somehow in the process of attempting to save this altered version of
System.Tool
(not using System3.Tool right now) I saved Oberon.Text which I was also
editing to match PPP.Tool instructions over the top of my System.Tool file.
I must now go back and reread and redo all the additons I attempted to make
but have no idea how this happened to me.  The inability to see the "Store"
button at the top of the System.Tool viewer is probably a part of this since
I must "grow" this viewer twice to full screen to see "Store" and click on
it then I must "close" twice to reduce the Systme.Tool viewer back out of
my way. :-\

I will post a separate message with the "notes" I made about PPP.Tool text.



Charles Angelich

The Ghost in the Machine!

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